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Post by zigtag on Jul 18, 2005 0:05:26 GMT -5
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Post by Anarchic Tribes on Jul 18, 2005 18:56:20 GMT -5
Techno music is a government scam used to control the masses.
Good to see ya Zig. How's it?
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Post by zigtag on Aug 1, 2005 20:59:00 GMT -5
lol AT. I wish they'd send some money my way  As a doco, better can be found, but it's interesting to see. The doco that got my attention more than any other this year has been What The #@%& Do I Know ? www.whatthebleep.com/trailer/ |
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Post by Anarchic Tribes on Aug 3, 2005 4:37:26 GMT -5
Hey Zig  if you're not financially benefitting from this deal then you're obviously not a drug dealer. Have you read this month's book, Ishmael, yet? |
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Post by righteousnesous on Aug 20, 2005 23:14:06 GMT -5
I just saw "The Take". Its clear that the film makers have strong Anarchist symapthies. That's fine.
However, I thought they were far to rough on Kirchner. The deal he worked out with the IMF (which the film canned as being a capitulation and back-down) was actually quite good. On very favourable terms for Argentina, and if it were followed around the world, the IMF would, perhaps, be bankrupted.
Of course, I'm far from an un-critical friend of the IMF, they have A LOT to answer for and there needs to be a lot of reform there. However, what would happen if there was no IMF?? Where would nations get $ for development from???
And yes, I premise this by saying, at present, the IMF is crap. The deals attached to loans are outrageous, as is its practice of consciously loaning corrupt countries money, and then expecting the nation to pay it back. However, if you hate the whole idea of the IMF and a global, (regulated) market economy more generally, what then would be your alternative??? Or put more simply, I would be interested to see how you think an anarchist model would work in practice. Perhaps this should go to another link...
In fairness, I don't think that the model demonstrated in "The Take" is workable in the longer term. As admirable as what the workers did is, I think its just a short-term solution in an economy which has collapsed. For in the longer term, how would the factories get built?? The factory taken over by the workers in "The Take" cost 90 million dollars.
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approve my registration
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Post by approve my registration on Aug 26, 2005 3:14:24 GMT -5
Righteousness:
In fairness, I don't think that the model demonstrated in "The Take" is workable in the longer term. As admirable as what the workers did is, I think its just a short-term solution in an economy which has collapsed. For in the longer term, how would the factories get built?? The factory taken over by the workers in "The Take" cost 90 million dollars.
Hydrarchia:
Indeed to a large extent despite the revolutionary veneer, the model so lauded in the film is simply that of self-management of capitalism. As such you correctly point out that it is likely to be solely a "short-term solution" as it depends on relations with other "taken" worker-managed businesses and the good graces of more traditional-owned national capitalists, the Argentinian State, and ultimately global capital (including such institutions as the IMF, WB, etc.)
I want a world without Capital's management (whether imposed from above or taken on as a survival task by ourselves) without monetarized mediation!
That said however, I did find the film inspiring...
'we are not in the least afraid of ruins
we are going to inherit the earth
the bourgeoisie may blast and ruin
their world before they leave this stage of history
but we carry a new world, here, in our hearts'
Durrutti
90 million dollars didn't build that factory, workers did. And someday we proles will decide if we wish to continue operating them in some non-hierarchical manner ourselves, or let them rust and construct other new forms of egalitarian and liberatory technical and social organization producing for our use. Either of which options, would be ultimately incalculable with any dollar amount.
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