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Post by workerscommunes on Apr 14, 2005 7:18:37 GMT -5
Hello there folks, sorry I've been away a while!
Just thought I'd bring up the topic of the forecoming election here in the UK. This will be the first time I've been eligable to vote in a general election but have not decided whether I'm going to or not. I can see some good arguments for and against personally although I think I possibly will. Does anyone here, whether from the UK or not, have a particular view on voting they'd like to share?
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Post by Liberaregno on Apr 14, 2005 8:10:30 GMT -5
welcome back, where were you btw if i may ask?
so...i can't really see why not to vote, i mean i've heard the nonos but could you tell me why you wouldn't vote? you know how the saying goes: 'you can't vote for anarchism' and i understand how the anarchists feel and support it, but for me, i couldn't think so since i think it's my duty to at least vote for the poor people if i can't do anything else.
who would you vote? i think i wouldn't vote the tony idiot blair's labor, which is way to the right, but i would neither like to see some even more conservatists in power. i don't really know much about the parties in uk, could you perhaps tell me a little bit about them? and which party have you planned to vote for?
isn't it btw so that you only vote for the party? in finland it's so that you don't vote for the party but you vote for the people in the parties. i think it's a better system here in finland.
i think the major flaw of this western democracy is the thing that sometimes (easiest to see in the US votings), you have to vote the party which is the least evil, and really the party you support. like in the last US presidential elections i didn't support none of those two, i would have gone with ralph nader, but if i was in USA i would have voted for kerry because i just disliked bush that much.
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Post by allers on Apr 14, 2005 10:37:12 GMT -5
Hello there folks, sorry I've been away a while! Just thought I'd bring up the topic of the forecoming election here in the UK. This will be the first time I've been eligable to vote in a general election but have not decided whether I'm going to or not. I can see some good arguments for and against personally although I think I possibly will. Does anyone here, whether from the UK or not, have a particular view on voting they'd like to share? What are your options/choices? for what i know in france/Netherlands i vote(mosly) white/blanko because i don't see any representative ideas, sometimes i do SP(CP) or Trotskyist in France ,still it is not representative .so i vote blanko or lesser bad... Beautiful democracy. |
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Post by Buck65 on Apr 14, 2005 20:20:29 GMT -5
thats part of the problem with US politics, Kerry is pretty much as right wing bush, the hugest differenace would be kerry might stop trying to praticly colonize the world, which is a start, but everyhtign else and it was still an indeision.
God I love being Canadian sometimes, we don't have to worry about any of this bullshit.
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Post by workerscommunes on Apr 15, 2005 5:29:35 GMT -5
welcome back, where were you btw if i may ask? Sure, I've just been a bit busy with work recently. who would you vote? i think i wouldn't vote the tony idiot blair's labor, which is way to the right, but i would neither like to see some even more conservatists in power. i don't really know much about the parties in uk, could you perhaps tell me a little bit about them? Well there are essentially two main parties who have a chance of getting into power, the Conservatives and the Labour Party, both of which are socially conservative neoliberals. Then there are the Liberal Democrats who are centre-right social liberals who promise all kinds of socially proggressive measures because they know they're never going to get elected. Then there's a few minor parties including the openly fascist British National Party, the xenophobic UK Independance Party, this rag-tag collection of Marxist nutcases and alienated Muslims called RESPECT and the Greens. Then there's 'Verritas' but I don't want to go into that... isn't it btw so that you only vote for the party? in finland it's so that you don't vote for the party but you vote for the people in the parties. i think it's a better system here in finland. No we vote for our local member of parliament. |
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Post by workerscommunes on Apr 15, 2005 7:25:53 GMT -5
I don't know if the corruption of elections is as thoroughgoing in Britain as it is here, but I have read some concerns about postal ballots. Anyway, WC, is there anyone actually worth voting for? The Greens, perhaps? I can't say, I haven't followed what's going on there closely enough. Yes there's been a lot of concern over postal ballots recently, I don't think it's a very good way of organising an election but as I'm living away from my local constituency I don't really have another option. I wouldn't imagine our elections are rigged somehow though. Indeed the Greens are probably the ones I'll end up voting for. You can get a good idea of each party's stance at www.politicalcompass.org/ on the UK elections 2005 section. And I suppose ultimately we should be asking whether the solutions to the problems we face are to be found in voting at all (I, for one, doubt that they are)...Or is voting at best a holding action to keep problems from getting worse? And if voting does not or cannot solve anything, is there a sense in which it might well be counterproductive, by draining people's energies and efforts into something pointless (more of a problem here, where the presidential "election" process actually runs for two years out of every four) and giving them false hope? And if it is counterproductive, what should we be doing instead, because simply not voting for the sake of not voting also is not something that empowers you or anyone else. It's more like saying, "I'm not a sucker." Beats feeling like shit, but it doesn't go too far, either. Well I think it's probably worthwhile to vote, even if it's just 'damage limitation' or whatever. I think that's more important then retaining a sense of 'moral authority'  (btw what did J.P. (Sartre, not 'the second') say about voting? I think he actually started calling himself an anarchist towards the end didn't he after all his Marxist silliness early on) |
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Post by allers on Apr 15, 2005 10:20:50 GMT -5
BHL = berard Henry Levy=nothing"quand je veux je retourne ma veste" And JP wrote in the 50's a piece other politic manipulation"les mains sales"....Good if you can find it Clin D'oeil |
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Post by Anarchic Tribes on Apr 15, 2005 15:38:49 GMT -5
I won't be voting and you can guess why  |
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Post by Anarchic Tribes on Apr 18, 2005 16:01:26 GMT -5
Ok that wasn't a very constructive comment, as ever. I live in a safe Lib dem area. Our MP voted against the war (as did most labour MPs) and FOR banning fox-hunting. If I was going to play the game (which I'm not) I'd probably vote Green or Respect. On the subject of Respect: Here's a "rough outline" of their manifesto from lenin leninology.blogspot.com/ |
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Post by Anarchic Tribes on Apr 18, 2005 16:05:59 GMT -5
WC,
wasn't there a problem recently in your area with the students postal votes?
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Post by workerscommunes on Apr 19, 2005 7:12:44 GMT -5
Hey AT, It seems I no longer need a postal vote as I'm just going to vote for my MP here in Liverpool. I'd rather have voted for my one back home as that's going to affect my parents etc but nevermind... Hmm Respect...I don't know, a lot of their policies seem pretty sound but I can't help thinking they're just the Veritas of the left  (btw if you're not from the UK, Veritas is a minor right-wing party run by a failed Talk show presenter in an attempt to get his face back in the papers) |
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Post by workerscommunes on May 5, 2005 8:18:23 GMT -5
Just voted. Can't say I feel any more shit than usual but it's early days. |
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Post by Anarchic Tribes on May 5, 2005 16:31:14 GMT -5
Well done I didn't vote and I feel crap, not sure that's it's related though. Actually I think I'd definately feel worse if I had of voted. I walked past a polling station today and there were 3 supporters from 3 different parties stood outside (you know them with the rosettes). And they were all chit-chatting "oh yes darling, la de da de dah blah blah". I liked the papers today though. The tories have become 'the joke party'. Brilliant stuff. Happy 05.05.05! ;D |
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Post by Anarchic Tribes on May 5, 2005 16:35:37 GMT -5
For some real politics, don't miss tonight channel4 22:40 |
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Post by Anarchic Tribes on May 6, 2005 20:07:55 GMT -5
Are you happy with the results? I thought it went as well as could be expected. Good night I reckon.  |
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